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Transcript: 207- Norm A- Seconds and Inches

Updated: Nov 6, 2021

207- Norm A- Seconds and Inches


Norm A 00:00

How do you tell anybody every living thing you are? Is it because of Alcoholics Anonymous I'll ever be in my life is going to be because of the program. I can totally tell you a friend It's been a long walk from Lincoln Heights, the LA county jail and appointed a standard day and but for the grace of God, Alcoholics Anonymous and friends right here I could have missed it off.

John M 00:25

What Hello Friends of Bill W and other friends you have landed on sober speak. My name is John M. I am an alcoholic. And we are glad you're all here, especially newcomers newcomers that is both to recovery as a whole. And newcomers to this podcast. sober speak is a podcast about recovery centered around the 12 steps of Alcoholics Anonymous. My job here on sober speak is simple. My job is to provide a platform to the amazing stories of recovery all around us. Consider sober speak, if you will, your meeting between meetings. Please remember, we do not speak for a or any 12 step community. We represent only ourselves. We're here to share our experience, strength and hope with those who wish to come along for the ride. Take what you want, and leave the rest at the curb for the trash man to pick up yalda yada, yada, and welcome to this here, Episode Number 207. That's dose zero. See. ya say See ya dose zero CFA here with Mr. norm A, and you're gonna hear much of Mr Norgay in just a moment. But first things first, this episode is brought to you by sponsored by if you will, not the same kind of sponsorship type of, you know, thing that we use in AIA or al anon or 12 steps up but you know, sponsored by Rachel and Michelle and April and Marie and Misha and Anna and Todd. Do you know what Rachel and Michelle and April and Marie ameesha. And Anna and Todd did when they went to our web site which you can find at WWW dot sober speak comm they click and by the way the lovely Mrs. m created that website Thank you Mrs. m. Anyway, they clicked on the little yeller donate tab and they made a contribution. Thank you so much Rachel and Michelle and April and Maria, Misha and Anna and Todd for helping us to keep the virtual lights on this app is coming right out to humans. I john m just another bozo on the bus will be the chairperson for this meeting between meetings and I am truly honored and privileged to serve all of you listening in. So take a seat if you will, around this virtual table and let's get started. Remember, no matter who you are, or what your past looks like, you are welcome here. It's an Open Table and we are glad that you have joined us I got a little bit choked up saying at that time for whatever reason they get back to where I've been and all the people that I've met Nate over the years and how it is and such an open and welcoming organization and I'm just I'm just so grateful that I found a I don't know where my life would have ended up if I hadn't. And I don't even like to think about that but I'm glad you guys are here with me today.

John M 04:26

I want to read a little bit from Mr. Gary Kay who many of you have heard on the podcast in the past? A Gary k posted in the super secret Facebook group this week he posted this by the way if you are not in the secret Facebook group go to Facebook look look up. Let me think about this. Now I get this wrong, sober speak secret group. And if you don't even though we call it super secret when you look on Facebook It's only secret group. But once you get in, yes, you are in the super secret Facebook group. But anyway, go to go find it on Facebook, ask for admission, and we will get you all in there. But anyway, Gary K, posted this in the Facebook group this year, this year this week, and this is from the 12 and 12. On page 91. Nothing pays off light restraint of tongue and pen. We must avoid quick tempered criticism and furious power driven arguments. The same goes for soaking or silence scorn. These are emotional booby traps, baited with pride and vengefulness. Our first step is to sidestep the traps. When we are tempted by the bait, we should train ourselves to step back and think we can neither think nor act to good purpose until the habit of self restraint has become automatic. Let me go ahead and read that again. That last little part there. Well, I'm going to read the first sentence and then lessons, not the whole thing again, it says nothing pays off, like restraint of tongue and pen. And nowadays, as you all know, that comes to texting and an email as well all I had was pins back then. And then the last line of this passage says we can neither think nor act to good purpose until the habit of self restraint, has become automatic. And I want to tell you, I needed to hear that or see that I guess this week meant a lot to me. I've had a really tough week emotionally To tell you the truth have been up and down. And there are other people involved with this. So I don't want to say exactly what it is because I don't want to talk about them. Right. But I can tell you in my little sphere here. It has been the definitely an up and down week, it has been something that is tax me. I lost a lot of sleep. I didn't do very well. And I feel like I'm starting to come out of the other side right now. But it was definitely without a doubt, a depression. And but thanks to Alcoholics Anonymous and the tools that you guys have given me. I do feel like I am breathing easier now. And I'm coming back out of that. But for all of you who are experiencing that right now, my heart goes out to you. You can't see me right now but I'm doing little nama stay your prayer hands. And I trust that you will come out of that place as well. God bless you and my prayers go out to you. Now on to Mr. Norm Alpi so this is normality. He has gone to the big meeting in the sky. That's why I'm saying his last name. He was from Monrovia, California. Speaking on this tape at the sound Whoa, scuse. Me, San Jose, round up in San Diego. Wait a second, the San Jose round up is San Diego, California. May 29 of 1982. That would be that doesn't sound right. But that's what my copy says. It would seem like

John M 08:50

it would seem like it's either in the San Jose in San Jose, or they had a meeting in San Diego named the San Jose roundup but who knows nonetheless, this is a tape and when I say tape, right i mean obviously a digital now but this is a cassette tape that I got when I was first sober. And I used to and you know back then, I mean now you can find tapes all over the internet, right? Or recordings I should say. But back then, you know you had to you know you had to go to a conference to find them or you had to know who was selling them. It was like a drug dealer type of thing I used to God this guy's house even lived out in the middle of Lewisville. No, you know I'd have to drive out there like 20 miles. I'd give him a you know, a 50 year or whatever and he'd give me all these tapes and then I'd come back and get my fix again, like in a month or two something like that. But nonetheless, this was a tape that I played in my little car. My little Honda CR x at the time I would stick this tape in and I would just play it over and over and over and it really meant so much to me in the beginning of my sobriety so I wanted to share this with you now. Norm is a great guy he is a legend in Alcoholics Anonymous. I know you're going to enjoy this. What what i what i find entertaining, at least for me is the number of time you'll hear him he uses the wire Ratan the those those rotten judges and those rotten whatever, I just love it when he uses that. He sounds like one of those to me. 1920s 1930s 1940s gangsters, right. In fact, right now I'm kind of picture in my head. What was his name? The guy who's to say you got a rat, your daughter. I think these are 1940s films or something like that. I've seen clips of them before. And I think it said James Cagney if I'm not mistaken. But nonetheless, he talks to me in from, from my perspective, he has that same sort of cadence to his voice. And I absolutely love it. I know you're going to enjoy this, sit back, turn this one up. just soak it all in for what it's worth. And these are the people who were very normal is one of the people who was very prominent in Alcoholics Anonymous in those early days to help carry the message. And I'm so grateful that he did what he did. So God bless you enjoy this and we'll have plenty Oh listener feedback on the end of norms episode. Enjoy.

Norm A 11:43

Thank you very much. My name is Norman. I'm an alcoholic from Monrovia and I'm extremely happy to have the opportunity to be here and I I want to thank Bruce and Henry on the entire committee for the opportunity to be here tonight to participate the opportunity to see some old friends and to reunite myself with some new from old friends and to meet some new people here to have the opportunity to say welcome to all of the new people that are out there tonight for your first second and third meeting of Alcoholics Anonymous and have you well in a way try to keep an open mind on what you can use right take it with you and if you can't use it, why be good enough to kick it out of the chair and leave it here and you've got to remember that anything I might try and say here tonight are going to be things that I personally believe in is going to be what the program of Alcoholics Anonymous means to me it's going to be some things that I've used to say sober over a period of time that I'm not by any stretch of imagination and authority a consultant or consular on the program Alcoholics Anonymous. I'm an example good or bad that a works that it has been necessary for me to take a drink steal anything and go to jail now for over 28 years. I'm sure that

Norm A 12:54

I really didn't think anybody be impressed. I am obviously I never brought it up. And you never know I've been talking about it for years. Yeah, we've had a lot of changes in AIA and I keep thinking you know somewhere down the road we're going to get a pension program going and by God if we ever do I sure want to get credit for all my time so I bring it up anytime I have the opportunity and if I don't have the opportunity I'm going to talk about it anyway but there's a new guy that's sitting out there tonight is difficult to digest. When you hear people talking about this sobriety you know you're sitting there and you're a couple of days sober you're nervous as hell or you're sitting on your hands jumping out of your knickers and you hear a guy say I haven't had any booze now for 28 years and you probably want to run outside and throw up and I can I can understand that I can still relate to it I hope to hell I never forget you know I'm sitting there and I'm first Alcoholics Anonymous meeting and at that time I was 29 years old and a guy sends out in front of the group that night and he says I am on unnecessary to take a drink steal and then go to jail now for nine and a half years and I I felt the same way you know what a liar Jesus was a liar or then I know a guy could go nine and a half years if he doesn't drink No How can you make it out there in that rotten jungle and deal with those lousy people and meet his responsibilities and and be sober for nine and a half years and I just couldn't visualize it anybody could do it and I hadn't come to a for nine and a half years compound the problem I come to AIA for a little while I think most of us did I I came in here because I had a lot of heat on out there and I wanted to get that heat off. I wanted to find some way to control this thing that was giving me so much trouble. I want to do a good back out and get going because I had a great deal to do. alcoholics are busy people and I had a lot of moving out there and I want to get out for it's all gone you know how that goes and I had a lot of my friends were out there my best friends and they were out there and I couldn't think of their names but they were my best friends and I I was concerned about their well being and I was glad to hear that they'd have a difficult time to survive if I wasn't there and I went on and on with this damn thing and I almost racialized myself right out the door and back into dogen Mills. But I I kept going to meetings and if I'm going to say anything tonight that maybe Never get why you got to go to meetings. You see, it's so very, very important. What do you been around for 28 days or 28 years, it really doesn't make much difference not as far as I'm personally concerned. You say I'm going to maintain any semblance of sanity and serenity and peace of mind and sobriety. If I'm going to find the equalizer in my life, I'm going to find it here on Alcoholics Anonymous, the answers to my problems, most of my problems, why I'll be able to relate the talk to the people here. You see other people out there on that street could have answered my problems Hello, still been out there? There's no question about it, but I couldn't until I came here and so they became the equalizer in my life. And today more so than ever. Last year was kind of a mass exodus over a half a dozen of my friends they were from 16 to 26 years and they all went back out again and there's all still out there. And I've talked to several of them and their stories are all the same that they just hadn't had any time for the last 1015 years to get to any meetings you say the equalizer in their life was long gone, they got involved in other things that they felt were more important than now they're out there struggling to try to get back again, easier to stay here you see, when you're new, it's very important because you've got a lot of questions and like hey, I'm concerned about the next nine and a half years and they assured me on a short period of time that I need to be concerned about the next day and a half years as all I had going for me was now right now there's enormous now and there isn't anymore you couldn't change what happened a couple of hours ago and I can't tell you what's going down a couple of hours from now that there's anything moving in my life is woven is right now and you're going to get all you can get right now good bad or indifferent because you may not be through this way again or maybe it's not going to be through again so you better get a hold of it you know all you can get and if you're sitting out there and you're brand new and is going good for God's sake don't talk me out Don't say to your sponsor hug them is going to God you always go on good man get it all you can get right now cuz I'll tell you buddy, it'll get salty later on. I'll guarantee Oh

Norm A 16:55

my golly, I come to find out that if I just kind of take care right now the dead take care of itself. And I've been moving away now for over 28 years. That was just the other day really that I walked through the door and I sat there and I was at meetings and I'm a brand new guy and I'm going through the mental gymnastics that everybody goes through is what the hell am I doing an AIA? Why am I an alcoholic? This isn't something I've been looking forward to over a long period of time. I have not gone down to my high school concert and he said What would you like to be and I said an alcoholic? God he was overjoyed my concert was he said marvelous. We got a hell of a program for jackasses boy. Yeah. I took that program and I rip that city for 15 years and I've been a as a matter of fact, I was not even an alcoholic the day before I came to the program. None of us were worried. We're all heavy drinkers. Victim of unusual circumstances on Rotten drivers my man I no alcoholic, you know. So I'm sitting here wondering why is it all of a sudden here I am. And I am an alcoholic. I'm an alcoholic, probably by virtue of my family. My family are all heavy drinkers. They did a lot of booze and out there. But I was the only alcoholic in the whole rotten family. And that bothered me a lot jersey, I thought why have I been given the crush to carry when I'm the best they produced? And there was never any question about that, because I talked to myself about that several times. And they the answer always came out. You are the greatest guy, you know, yes. Well, why are you an alcoholic? Nobody in your family's alcoholic and I couldn't solve that problem. And my people were fine. People don't get me wrong, and I love them. And they love me. My people are Irish, Italian. They're not overly intelligent. They talk a lot with their hands. Had to pour to paint and too proud to whitewash and I'd take care of 75 years out there. But my God, when you want to know something about booze, you come to see us and we'll tell you about it. We not only told you about it, but we made it. The Italians made it the Irish drank it and I got the a and that's about the way it went. Yeah. I fell between my family and the environment that the problem was there. I'm a product of LA and anybody coming out of Los Angeles had a lot of trouble with it, though LA is a city and then and you can get out anywhere you want to get out of if you want a bad enough, and you only make the sacrifices together to do it. I have people places and things don't make anybody anything. Now whiskey made me alcoholic. And he said now they're new tonight when maybe your promise is identical to mine. And I figured it all out all by myself. It was a risky. That was it. I drink that whiskey on there as hard and as fast as I could drink it. And somewhere on that lottery Am I alive? I cross some invisible line from the social aspect of drinking to the compulsive area. wines to man in 1000 aren't enough looking for the answer live in the quarter whiskey and I can't find it. The whiskey was the problem and I'm the guy that did the drinking. So when you get down to the bottom line, I'm a problem. That hasn't changed. I've joined clean today. Because no matter where I go, I'm the first guy to get there. I don't think any of us had to call somebody up and say Charlie, I'm down here on Vermont, will you please come down and help me get a screwed up. I have never had to do with that. I've been able to overreact to any situation anywhere. Anytime. I don't anybody else out there. I had all that before ever took a drink. I still revert back to that old person. From time to time I'm the first guy to admit that making money is good but getting even better a lot of times that's the way it used to be. That was me these were all the qualifications I had long before that booze I traveled half the world and half my life I made a complete awesome I saw I spend money I didn't have buying things I didn't need to impress people it didn't like. I sat around them barstools and talked to them high rollers about being all things to all people I built the castles in the air and from the corporations I taught them million spent and 1000s have never had $1 in the pocket I drove the Cadillacs up and down the bar night after night after night. And when big money people said what do you do man? I said I do it all boy, I thought I'm the general manager of the universe. And don't you ever forget that the alcoholic spends a lifetime impressing a group of people he's never met in these life that he is something he isn't. You might find in August driving around la with a Windows roll up my car to make him think I had an air conditioner. You know.

Norm A 21:10

The beauty of it is when I came into the program, I found out that I didn't have to operate. I didn't have to live that way any longer. When I got to a well the people said to me straight out sunny don't impresses here. We have been impressed by experts in the business. Because everybody in AIA is an expert. And the beauty of that statement is you didn't take my word for it. All you got to do is just kind of talk to the guy next year you got anything. I don't care what it is. He's gonna comment on it. He knows know what you're talking about. He'll probably say that's true. Yeah. Well, you discover you're around a lot of experts. And no matter where you've been this guy got here before you did. I remember one night I was telling this guy I'd already be impressed. It was known as you know, I've been in jail about 25 times. He says early on, I did that in a year, you know. So you learn real early, just lay it all down and grab the package that's available to you here and be yourself. I don't have to compete with anybody today. I don't have to compete with you, or you, Eli. All I got to do today is to be solver and be a little bit better than what I was yesterday. And that's enough. If you're new here this evening, you might give it a little thought and you just might grab that package. And you might take it out with me tomorrow and I'd city street and you might spend a day just being sober, being yourself and being a little bit better than what you were yesterday. And I can tell you without any reservation whatsoever. It's the best deal I ever had in my life. And I'm a guy that look half the world out there trying to find the best deal and I didn't find it not until I got here and was surrounded and introduced and subjected to a marvelous group of people chose to call themselves Alcoholics Anonymous. Sad to tell you just briefly about what I was like I told you a great deal I got a bad attitude and by virtue of my bad attitude, I got a rotten attitude as a matter of fact, and because of my rotten attitude I had a lot of rotten trouble out there on my rotten trouble started in 1939 I wouldn't drink it in 39 I was stealing beer I was too young to drink I am a thief by trade I'm an alcoholic by absorption I was the vice president General Manager on the outside operations of the midnight auto supply in the San Gabriel Valley. I was in the car business if I can sum it all up by server was too big to carry I lay down beside it and claimed it and that was when I became one of the greatest and finest currencies that ever came out of the valley but it was illegal I was arrested I went to jail and that was the end of that vocation. After I got out of the Can I started I suppose looking for something that was gonna get me all moving that Fantasyland and that booze walked in. And the first time I was drunk in my life was a 1941 it was Easter week in Los Angeles Easter week bow ball beats the rendezvous ballroom Stan Kenton and Padre bear and what to do Jesus wait that we joined a little Padre and we get a little buzz on we go on that dance on the dance with him valleys and we back four times dragon well we weren't we were breeze on him girls your big man from LA baby. What do you say I got a little booze out there in the car. Yeah. That was a lot of fun. Hell, it was fun. In the beginning I didn't have any trouble in getting any jams. I didn't wake up in the morning have more to drink. On the weekends as a way we either went to the Cotton Club down in Culver City or the train out in Southgate or the Pasadena City or the rendezvous ballroom and down Balboa and there was a Dorsey brothers and Kenton and the rest of it was fine. I kind of grounded out I moved out a Padre because I never give you enough to get a buzz on and I'm gonna look for the buzz. And I'm over on the pond rage of the rain area the old green death and from the green Delta moved into whiskey. And when I got the whiskey I found that the greatest thing made sense money in girls was whiskey. I even got into boy my level like the taste of it. Yeah, God wouldn't break my sponsor drank for over 30 years and hated every drop. He ever drank it all but I got to the point that I liked the taste of it. But I liked the buzz man that whiskey gets your attention and it gets better. Right now to get your downtown and man that's all I ever wanted to be I want to be downtown I don't want to get there in a little bit I want to get there right now and you got to admit that he does difficult in the beginning when you're young and you're training out there and I broke it on at 10 High and that was about as rotten as you can get that old town high burn gone and common and ran out my nose and made my eyes water but I I hung in and I think that's important you know the guy's gonna be an alcoholic he doesn't give up because he he's a little does he? You stay in air man. And the day comes you're gonna drink a pint of whiskey and you don't hear anymore and you kind of feel good all over a lot of dodgy Yeah, I was the beginning of the end that whiskey started getting me in more trouble I had been in before I violated my probation in the end of 41 they were going to send me back to jail. I had the war broke out by then and rather go to jail again the MTA join the service. So I joined the Navy. I went in the Navy in January 1942. I stayed for years I went into semen came out of semen that's

Norm A 26:05

pretty hard to do. People said Oh, Jimmy, oh norm. How did you do that? And I said, you just put your mind to it. That's all right. An alcoholic he couldn't do on if he wants to. And how the guys? How can he didn't get a kick out of BCD? Or s'mores? You know, I said I'm, I'm sure like most alcoholics. I'm a hard worker. Are you sad about most of the alkies You know, they're hard workers. They got to work 25% higher than anybody else just to stay even out there. Right? That old alkies always coming from behind. He's always got the heat on. In order to get the heat off. We always get when he's right. He's got to go. My best day is Tuesday. We miss Monday, man we've ever held his date. I lay we run all over. We're going for jobs in one getting that heat off out there. And that was a story of my life. I like ships I like to see when I was aboard ship and I was at sea I did a good job. I had engineering trouble I sure I drank some of that shipboard juice, little Aqua velva vitalis sneaky paid, low fermented coconut juice, a few things like that. I had stuff made by all those amateur distilleries, but I was able to kind of keep it under control. When I ship pulled in a port and I was on a beach man I'm gonna jam one jam after another. I never got back to the ship until he hauled me and I was court martialed for many, many things. Not a deck of summary in a general court. I did 11 and a half months in the Navy break up on top of gold. I don't know the general court martial at 7080 days solitary confinement on Bretton waters, a lot of miscellaneous things that are important but all directly due to booze, I survived the service. And I came back to LA and 4646 that invisible line I made mention I passed it. I'm that guy out there really looking for that answer live in that corner whiskey now can't live with it and can't live without and don't want to. I crossed that invisible line, I really couldn't tell you 1920 doesn't really make any difference. But in in 1946, I'm now starting to always come from behind. In 1946, strange things happened. In spite of myself. I heard about a in 1946, I was having a bad time and a rotten town down south called Pasadena. Bad town. bad cops rotten judge terrible jail. I was having a lot of problems in our town. I got picked up on my second final two, I went from the judge and the judge says a year suspended three year probation. He said your probation stipulates son that if you're at a place that serves or sells alcoholic beverages, you're in violation. When I hear about it, or the probation department hears about it, you're gonna be violated, and you're going to jail and you got to give me an idea. Get the hell out of my car. And I remember that day like yesterday, and I'm walking down the courtroom in that sigh of relief and all that I've got through one more jam that I'm saying to myself, self, don't drink and pass it in. Right? You don't have to have 130 iq to know you're having a hell of a lot of trouble in that town. And it all seems to revolve around his moods. So don't do any drinking there or I'm not gonna and I stayed out of town to three months, the inevitable happened. Things are going good. I'm drinking one night down on the beach towns. I remember the cardinal sin was thinking I started to think an alcoholic should never do that he should think or drink but he should never do on both the same time. Because I got to thinking about silly things like I'm going back to Pasadena. Yeah. Well, that makes a lot of sense. About 10 o'clock in your house smashed. As I got in my automobile, a job bank to Pasadena and I pulled into a place called Green jazz. I met a buddy of mine and we decided to close the place and we did. And the last thing I remember is where we're headed regal rock, there was an after hours joint over there. And that's the last thing I remember to a car made a left turn in front of me and I couldn't see it. And I smashed into the side of it. And when I woke up in the morning, I was in jail in Pasadena.

Norm A 29:54

I thought buggin slip out of my pocket and I'm saying it on a 501 felony drunk driving hit and run by Landry involved and I might add but for the grace of God that looks after damn fools and drunks I didn't kill for people out there in the city street that night is the alcoholism is a game of seconds and inches, you know, a few inches, a few seconds, a snap of the finger, three and a half, four feet. That's all you got to talk about. That might have been over about three and a half feet or the broadside of that car, the rate of speed I was trying to kill the people. I recognize that today. But how strange it is God moving in these strange, mysterious ways and no matter what I do, I don't do it works out that way. Anyway, here I am, I am back into a town that I shall never get back to again to hit a car and I walked down and sat in front of a judge who has no choice but to send me to jail. And in the city jail I shared a jail cell with a guy who was going a now that's crazy in your honor. 250 guys to do one time. One guy gets out of jail once a week to get a some people used to pick him up. They take him to a meeting. He was a trustee, it was an honor system. They take him to a meeting and they bring him back. I would lock him up and we would sit there and we were talking about this program. I didn't want to talk about it. He want to talk about it is that we talk you don't have a big audience and a jail cell. And he would always come back to say norm Why don't you come to a meeting you're in here because of bosun. Why did you go to a meeting with man and I told him no words to this effect I just silly I'm not an alcoholic. I don't need this thing whatever you want. Oh there's a thing I'm having a lot of problems and bad luck and rotten people out there and a hell of a lot of bad drivers. And good god I'm much too young to be an alcoholic is it Jesus I get to be your age you're 36 you know what do you really got to look forward to you what do you have to contribute to anybody out there you might as well go Hey, I have nothing else lab and that was the end of that he had his violin moment you know that seed was planted and I never forgot about that guy and over the next eight and a half years periodically I used to wonder what the over under Sally I want to restore around I wonder if A is here. I wonder if he's gone in 1954 in February I'm laying on the floor and I'm not as sick as I'd been a long time and I'm laying there thinking I don't I just can't go on this way and I I got to wondering what the hell is all Sullivan do I want to be still going to sing a you know I wanted and I picked up a telephone and I call the central office in Los Angeles because I was trying to find a guy named Sullivan I shared a jail cell rather than 1946. That seems extremely strong. I didn't go to a meetings I knew very little about a you're sitting out there new tonight way the seed is planted. And now you may choose to go back out again. And you may just be sitting around them Jen Mills out there but rest assure we're going to be with you by God. I'll tell you that. I have because I one thing we guarantee here as well absolutely louse up your drinking that much is for sure. I hope the hell you don't have to go but if you do, I hope you come back to see us. I stayed out there eight and a half years I drank a lot of whiskey. And although I might qualify for this program. I wanted to work on the largest construction firms in the world. I stayed with them 11 years. The company at that time was owned and operated by three yoga slaves that came from the old country that made all their money with hard work and good whiskey. So I fit how we got work going in the 11 western states. Were in a pipeline versus the towel business. I hit that high road you know I'm at the right place at the right time. And the jobs are bigger and better and our money's coming in. I'm drinking better booze and better places and life is good. And I had a little setback. I met and married a redheaded Irish woman had a violent temper or rotten disposition yelled at me a great deal never recognized my sensitivity and was pregnant every other year it was incredible. I know my buyer associates who told me no I'm don't ever marry alone I got a job you're in deep trouble. Make sure she's working you've now doubled your income. I've had midnight damaged a lot of sense. I've been running with all red we've been going around together and we decided when I returned to trek we got married she had a hell of a job things couldn't have been better. couple of months later I walk in the house the impossible scene she says nor my bender the doctor I'm pregnant I had to quit my job I got to get off my feet I couldn't believe what I was hearing he was

Norm A 34:33

telling me anything else I need that I believe that I even asked for a second opinion on it saying what the hell

Norm A 34:44

he shared me this is where it was going to be and I got to thinking well I there's no like that that caper takes about nine months and I will give it to you to get on our feet we get the rotten job back and everything's gonna be just like a was just like it was Jesus. I was 34 years ago she turned attacks and she got a seven eight times that was unbelievable. I used to sit around again not home that much either now that Vatican row let that number come up 14 every other year here's a goal you know Jesus and I'd rotten disposition to her should I be gone a couple of days and I walk in my house and Jesus I'm tired I've been busy. And I'm sick and a little junky and and I'd like to be greeted with a little love affection and understanding of how you walk through the door from 10 teachers yelling you're drunk again. You're drunk again. I used to send a dumb fan I wonder how the hell is he? No. I remember Sunday I had a bad day. But Donna Helens peppertree in Baldwin Park and I'd have a conversation with a guy we had a disagreement. And he called Maya and I got dried blood all on the side of my face my search store and I got one shoe on and I was trying to figure out how the hell she had been drinking I had Marla story I was gonna let her in on she never got the opportunity I get drunk again. I want conversations I say who me like 30 guys are with you. Yeah, yeah, you and I get it what I big when I say baby. Do you know who you're talking to? A typical alcoholic I would use myself. I am and don't you ever ever I got bad. You're trying to let her in on a hell of a deal. And then she would mimic me as an Irish woman. Good dude. Yeah. That's who I am. That's so degrading for highroller standing in the kitchen with his new business partner. That's a fairly you met in the bar last night you have invited him home. And the ladies coming home with you as well. He don't want to go home alone either. He's married to an Italian girl as bad as already are the blind leading the blind will embarrass me in front of my best ran. I couldn't think of his name You know? And then she tell me what to do her best friend. I says what are you going to be I'm leaving this job and never coming back. What are you thinking that she's gonna close out. And then I pick all the clothes out of the car and in and out. You know, loading up that car that old clothes packing out all

Norm A 37:33

your exciting beach Gunsmoke gonna be out there low Ws guy hanging his horn driving off down the street. And as a son said never to return to wake up a couple of days later on the front seat of your car because that's where you're sleeping. Your head screwed up on the armrest and the door handle in your air right? Man that car sleeping I'll get you Today I'll guarantee you the other way goodbye at midnight you're sick as hell and you think your windows down but he right in your window and you knock the hell out of your head. And then you sit there roll the downs race race race, right. I wonder why don't roll down Brahim on it. I wonder Yes. He's become giant problems in the life of an alcoholic. I got to go home because I got to wash the car out and on the way home I have a flat tire. But no self respecting alcoholic would change a flat tire when he's drinking. He drives on them. Because he knows everything that is disagreeable in our lives will go away. We drink enough booze all goes away. The tire goes away. He gets all chewed up. You're driving on the rim. Well, a lot of rim drivers and a GMC rim driver coming home. He's got to turn that car into that driveway. Up in the lawn opens the door falls out.

Norm A 39:16

He lays out there for a while so the neighbors can inspect the bow there. He gets up. He says to himself. I wonder if anybody show me

Norm A 39:28

this because he's deeply concerned about what people think about him. Without only a reputation. We don't do anything about it. We just worry about it. There's nothing

Norm A 39:44

out there in the gym Mills like the dark rice and the rotten music. I like the intellectual giants. I like sitting there midnight. Hell by midnight looking at that Marian. You gotta get that Maybelline look kind of wide eyed. You devil Well you are incredible how good looking you get in it can you wonder why all the dollies aren't there yeah good luck and Rob Bell and electrohome wealthy got a $30 smile and Frankie Gordon suit on 50 cents where the Chili's all down funny their smell bad and you can't jog to go to the men's room just to pay toilet damn got the money to get in you got to slide out of the door I bet there's some doors sliders here tonight here just slide in manual slide out here's a drum kit oh no once you get in all you got to do is just turn the handle and walk out but not the alcohol I got he slides and downhill slide out

Norm A 40:56

every laugh but it is very funny while we're going through this Evan loving thing we own means anything in our life yet evitable little by little it's gone. The rails of alcoholism I grind very slow but very fine you're given enough time and the eventually there you are and there's nothing one day the people I work for and did business with said that's it. The only slab sold on 51 nation from Poland and they said that's it. The next time I ever smell booze on your breath, your throat get out. And I drove home one day now one more lie one more promise the schemer how many times that I stand there with a tears going down saying baby Jesus babies in the break me out hell I got a deal. A new priest he was telling me about I'm going down take another pledge baby that that's what the hell I'm going to do you think of them kids now God the schemer. This day she says no, I'm you're a drunken bum. join him saw me. Drinking yourself to death. Hell, you'll never live to be 35 years old. You don't have to get on my life. I'm an erotic to kids in erotic. All I do anymore is sit around all night looking out through the bedroom window just to see your car come up the street. And a night you never come in. I don't sleep. And the nights I don't sleep. I hear the sirens run. And I'm thinking the cops. Gotcha. You're dead. And I'm not going through it anymore. I call an attorney norm. I file for seven maintenance a very receiving are against you're not I'm going to divorce Yeah. None of my life. I'll always love you. But you try out all the feeling. I'm feeling for you one way or another. As the alcoholic I can't believe that I'm listening to because these things always happen to everybody else and never happen to you and I drink enough booze long enough, hard enough, be alcoholic, I guarantee it's gonna get it. And you find yourself driving on down the street wondering why me Why Why? Well, you know, and I know, give it enough time and it gets it until the inevitable is you're standing out in the morning, you're washing your face, you're brushing your teeth, you're sitting there, and you're looking in the mirror and you got to hang your head because what you see a Sunday you can't tolerate because you lost the freedom to your own. You live the respect to yourself as a human being as an individual. A man walked in, he says you've used the privilege of owning it, and he took it away.

Norm A 43:29

And you walk around contingently with that knot in your stomach. no remorse eats you alive and you can't face living. And it becomes a psychological second in your life when you're sick and tired of being sick and tired and made is the first time you come into the program. And maybe it's a 10th to the 15th day. But it's that time you just say I surrender. And you don't even know you say it. I'm laying on that floor in February of 1954. And for some unknown reason I just don't want to go anymore. I made mention I walk out I pick up a telephone I get information I get a hold of the LA central office I call and I get a hold of a guy over there and his name is Johnny fee. And as john was one hell of a guy's one of those guys, you hear about a giveaway what he found he worked for beads and that central office, given away what he found. La central office has made it possible for people like me to be here today. There's absolutely no question about it. That same old guy on a Thursday night if you went down the old Alhambra meeting, you walked up the stairs and up the top of the stairs sitting on the railing was a guy named Johnny z. And he had an eye for the new guy you're walking in the meeting. He grabbed swatch it he grabbed me by the army take here as you pour your cup of coffee and you take your new ones you sign and you're young and keep an open mind with you. Keep coming back for a lot of meetings. Get a whole a three and a half and buy yourself a book. This is one of your do those things. You'll never have to take another drink again if you don't want to. And that's the guy that I talked to on that Sunday afternoon. That's a guy that said Deanna, do you think he got a drinking problem? I told him I thought I did and He gave me that. He gave me a lot of information. He also gave me some phone numbers. He says, call these numbers. He said, these are people in about in your area. He said you're gonna hold them, they'll be able to see it. So I started calling and pretty soon I got ahold of a guy and he's just hanging out beyond a couple of hours. And a couple of hours later, a guy walks in. He says down, he started to talk to him. And he's one of them old, hard hearted sponsors. He had about a, I used to think they sent him to school to be a hard heart as long as our you know, his attitude was boy, hey, you want this program? You gotta want it as bad as you wanted that whiskey. And if you don't want it that bad, he said, You're wasting your time. You're wasting my time you're wasting your time. He says, Don't you ever forget this, you need us and we don't need you. That's the way it is. And you're gonna come and get it. He said it he got a car, you drive and you haven't got a car, you take the bus, and if you haven't got the money, you'll walk. He said, your walk for whiskey, you're gonna walk with a program, it's a better deal. He said, If you want me to be your sponsor, I thought he was kidding. I didn't know what the hell his sponsor was. But whatever it was, I didn't want him. I was sure. All I could think about when he left was all I could think about is I'm going to that meeting. He says I'm going to be down at the temple city meeting right? He says at Temple city group me Shannon Rosemead, and a town called Rosemead, I want to ask you why the hell I didn't change the name but didn't have the guts to ask him. He's not going to be down if you want to come on down. He says I'll be there. He said, I'm going to show you around. I'm going to get you some numbers. I'm going to tell you I'm going to meet your three meetings and he says then it's up to you whatever you want to do. Now, as a matter of fact, he believed you know, if you had a car, you weren't even ready. He said the last couple of years old, they'd sharpen up a great deal. I'd been taking chances on guys with cars. He said a lot of guys are making it and they either have wristwatches, some of them do you know, miserable. I went down to that meeting. I went down in spite of him. I went there in spite of myself. I don't even know why I went down. I went down there to show him I had a car maybe run over him with it. I know I like to do that.

Norm A 47:03

God directed the angels on my shoulder color what you will. I pulled into the parking lot there and my god he was waiting and I was kind of surprised. He walked up to the car and he opened the door and I got out and they put his arm around me and we walked into the meeting and and God I loved you from that day to day died. I love him today. very controversial individual, tremendous speaker carry the message to hundreds and 1000s of people out there. God knows how many people he helped. He had a very difficult time he couldn't turn his role in his life over the care of anybody on an all time basis. Chapter Six I was for everybody else out there but chapter six. At that time for that tolerance, a god given quality that says that another man lived his life the way he wants to. But the more he's proven Oh, he wants to work another way I want to direct but he couldn't do it. He couldn't release anything. People resented that and then he resented them. Then resentments ate him alive. eluxury the alcoholic can't afford resentments. And he made a decision they drink a little he stayed out there 12 years he tried to come back time and time again but his ego wouldn't let him stay that ego that killer the alcoholic because his ego gets him to carry the message to help the people how many times I heard you say norm norm Jesus all the guys I sponsored Christ on there my sponsor now they go back out. They have a severe heart attack after damn near 12 years. They came back to see as he said a year and a half now he died. And I love them. Because he's the guy that took the time to come to see me. He's the guy who took the time to meet me down on that Sunday and then bring me in for a cup of coffee and introduce me around 7080 of the finest drunks ever came out of the San Gabriel Valley I'll tell you that an extremely wealthy group in those days my god we had so much money in the group in those days we had doughnuts before and after the meeting and you believe that red jelly doughnuts assign a true status red jelly doughnuts. Not crummy all plain doughnuts are rotten cookies red jelly doughnuts. They're extremely good eating good for new people my god yeah, you see a new guy coming through the door and he's all green and hung out and the red jelly donut committee and slide up on in a nice to have your hair your new washer Would you like a donut?

Norm A 49:22

Did you ever look at a red jelly donut Do you got a hangover guys omega tch I'll guarantee another man shut up mother and father good. NATO when he was like What have you tried to like now the only CENTRAL AVENUE group but the whole media on those days Why? Once a month why some outside group would come in and they put the whole meeting on that night it was the only CENTRAL AVENUE group. The only Jewish figures and I remember their names they were they really shark's fingers. One of them was a fella named okay. Another name that goes a gal Her name was well name j was domestic for one of the movie people in in Hollywood and she'd found the program to him. He had never made The program but she had enemies figure was that guy out there is that necessary to take a drink stealing or go to jail for nine and a half years and I I couldn't believe what I was looking at nine and a half years. He talked about how people knock the hell out of him and I went to jail he but I'm already at jails. He drinks and stuff called Jamaica ginger and you're getting the Jake leg and incredible amounts of men and put them in a hospital for a couple of months. And everybody is hysterical because a mugger can't walk. And your sponsor said they're going to do here to do what the hell so funny about it, you know, Jake leg? I don't even know what he's talking about. I'm sitting here thinking what the hell am I doing here? I'm under qualified. What kind of a story Have I got a gut check. I've been in 25 rotten jails that the outside I drank a little vitalis and that Sneaky Pete it ain't nothing compared to that guy. I'm too young. And any issue with a big one doesn't make any difference. Doesn't make any difference what you drink or where you drank it, or how much you consumed or how old you are. It's what is doing to you. He said it was tearing up any part of your life. You don't have to go any farther. And as I sat there that night, the one thing I knew pass a shadow of a doubt to the toilet hell on of my life. I'm not so sure I want to quit drinking now. But I'll tell you one thing for sure. I'm tired of hurting myself. I looked at that guy that night. And I knew that I didn't have to ever ever hurt myself again if I didn't want to. Because he hadn't. And he is a gay and he is nine and a half years. And he is an example. And that's what a is a program of example. Three years big, so loud, I cannot hear a word he says set a straight man out of La 120/5 and figure all maybe Sandra that night and he's clean and he sharpened His eyes are clear and he's dressed goodness. He's got on a set of threads probably cost him 100. And I'm thinking boy, if he didn't get anything else out of a what a set of drapes he got isn't that all right. I I just might hang around. I might have another issue going through here. Who knows? And I am really impressed with what I see. And he says I can do it. If I can do it. You can and I'm thinking he's talking to me and I'm thinking maybe what the hell he's, he's got a tough go. His woman is divorced and remarried. His kids. They all hated him. Yeah. But one day, he bought the whole package of this program. And his kids came down to see him one day because he had a change of attitude. And they already know like him to respect him and I loved him. And then he wanted to look around and I didn't but when I look around I see that he had a big tough guy sitting there the 200 pounds six foot Hey shakers of South El Monte Gabi acres with Omar sitting there and the tears are streaming down their face, and they don't care. They just let him roll with dignity, they cry for the joy of it. And the story was told that they would laugh because they were miserable and they cried because they were happy and they call it Alcoholics Anonymous. And you may sit there tonight and say that's oversimplification and maybe that's the only program I got. You see I found through the laughter the program I could clear out the wreckage of my past through the laughter the program and discovered a way that I could help her out in the wreckage of the future would you walk down to see me? I hope you don't. But Raja Give me the strength to laugh a little further laughter I found a way to take 1000 pounds of guilt off my back and I laid it down and through the laughter I was able to walk out and be among them. I made a transition and I quit I quit taking and I saw I started to give a little and taking you see is by nature that's me. I'm gonna take her things and a user of people I'm a loser all takers are losers you're looking to one here I had absolutely nothing in my life until I learn to have something you must give something to pick up an ashtray coffee cup to put away the chairs will become the secondary of the group.

Norm A 54:05

Service General Service are they gonna call on the guy that suffering out there in the street, and we don't guarantee that you're gonna find anything necessarily in a material sense. But in the sense of well being. I'll give you the world a free free well being. I drank whiskey because it gave me a sense of well being I felt good to give me a buzz. I hit that plateau and I'm bozi over and over one more just to say even down the chute. When I woke up in the morning, I was gone. And his face was a friend of mine remorse. What do you say norm? Now, check out your guts. I drink a little whiskey. He's gone. But it was a temporary thing. I traded that in for the sense of well being I've experienced here. And all I've had to do is be willing to be willing to give a little bit a hell of a return helping people To help themselves to get into the day and that's what the bottom line is all about. Because I look back now and I dig it all those days way I then knew turn it all back. The second meeting I went to was almost the last thing I ever attended in Alcoholics Anonymous I went to as I was walking on that type of city meeting my friend your system I'm gonna go straight goobers in Pasadena. I said your kid is always gonna pass it in on Monday night. I just pass it is a rotten town Why would you go there? He says I'm going to want to go Don't go Don't drive that far. I'm gonna go oh my god. There's a little nervous but I pulled into Pasadena. Why did I go to St dribbles the old timers group you had to be sober. 10 years read the stamps. I had a speaker that night Ben 137 years he was old timer. The guy's name was already I got to know already got to love them. When I already spoke of these a minis he always showed a picture of himself. It was a great big bone up mug shot taken normally during time the county jail the point that he tried to get across here when I'm drinking Look at me now. I got a picture I got it. I got it.

Norm A 56:11

I gotta get the hell out of here. ageism the next day on the way to work. I'm coming down in Ohio and went to Irwindale. And it's Tony's liquor store in Allendale the guy made a left turn and it always did fall into Tony's liquor store I walked into this Tony Tony there it is. Get out of the car broke it took a drag throw it away from my daughter versus husband necessarily take a drink God knows in strange mysterious ways no matter what you do or you don't do it works out the way anyway. Nice ones he said you got to go to three meetings that I didn't want him to think I couldn't get to three meetings as I went to the third meeting and I met a half a dozen guys and we're about the same age and we started going together running together having meetings together, having meetings after the meetings together getting that in depth inventories taken notice there's a lot of flakes and a lot of cliques formed our own click to begin some other clicks on that as well you got to do one one of our guys was Secretary of the largest group in the San Gabriel Valley politics a little God Amen. week after he Secretary joined the other clicks to Dan Paul put us all on coffee detail and a lot of silly things but we all say sort of how we woke up one day to find out that the only clicks on a is a click click clicking in your head and what do you got you got people in a you got people from all walks of life you got people you wouldn't do any drinking with and people you're not going to get sober with but I was at a guy told me years ago and his name was Glenn Glenn said norm Let me tell you some sunny man or woman was talking about just like his ability to ever like to see you take a drink Do you know that? Hell no, no, his guys might hate your guts. But if you called him up and said Charlie, we have come to see me. You know what norm he'd be down to see you because he wouldn't want to see you go back out there in that jungle and get torn up in a grinder one more time. That's got to be as good a deal as you ever going down and I believe it I'd also like to be able to tell you the night that every day is a holiday and every meal is a banquet that there ain't no parking on the street. But that is when we guaranteed about it and we sobriety in a way life buddy whatever you're you're going to be better at you're a ditch digger you got to be a better ditch digger. You're gonna have to be responsibilities. And you're gonna have to stand to be counted. And I can almost guarantee you that you're gonna have some things out there that I'm gonna go to good in 1962 that eight year syndrome the eight Year Itch I couldn't hit a lick everything I touched turned to puking. Financially I'm in the worst condition of my life. I let my ego overrule My God said I'm making a deal with a guy I know it ain't gonna run but I couldn't see it. I got an honest desire to take a drink. I got to a ram first. I can taste bad whiskey go on down I got a bad program moving. I'm born in meetings and I'm hating it and I'm hating myself. And I'm sitting down in Miami springs one night and the bartender says Well yeah, and I said Jimmy a double but for the grace of God that quick but for the grace of God he didn't find it necessary to snap that Angel off my shoulder. He took me back for a minute and let me remember the important the essential of who I was and where I came from the center sitting around crying and formality about what you didn't get what you did get you better remember who you are. You better remember what you have. You better say thank you very much for what you got. Yeah, you better remember everything's cut to size. The big loads the big horses, and the small ones the guy's name norm. I'm trying to prepare your movie for what's coming later on. And later on, I do I shouldn't try to say lose hospital and I said Jesus Christ. Why? Why me? One more time Why? And then again, I knew it's a heavy load, but it's not as bad as it could be. I guess I want to say thank you. I want to say thank you today. Thank you very much for the 28 years in a few months if you let me walk out there on the sunny side of the street boy, but I know guys who died never saw 28 days. They died out there on the street of booze and fantasy busted dreams and broken hearts and tears by the bucketful that also is a brother program to me in 1946, that after three years, he went back out, and he drank. And he had an internal hemorrhage and he bled to death. And he went out as hard as you can go because he had the heat on and the screws down. And the terrible part of it all was that he had to justify his existence to the bitter end. Today is the I haven't had to justify my existence anybody. I'm not coming from behind. I'm doing the best I can do with the equipment that God gave me. I spent a day on the street and on the street, it was clean. I'll get old and I'll go on home. When I get home to my house, I'm walking in that house. And a house I'm loving as a woman and she's my woman. She's redheaded and she's Irish. But she's generally glad I'm coming in most of the time you know you don't get the whole thing straightened out after 34 years it takes a little time you know

Norm A 1:01:08

she respects me because I'm Oh man. No more no less ability as long as nobody has cried in my house today because oh man was drunk trnava I heard a kid of mine scream me for years I had the opportunity to raise the big ones in St. Louis and get some education and go to some schools not that that's a big deal but it's a big deal my family because there's nobody cut it that far. I got two sons that are my business partners today. I got daughters that I take a downtown one by one by one I bought my first pair of high heeled shoes ever putting the feet now you don't sound like much unless you've missed it. Then you know what I'm talking about. to say to a chicken, come on chicken. We're going downtown baby. I'm gonna buy a pair of shoes because you're going to answer tonight. And we went down and she put on the shoes. She became a woman in front of my eyes. The chickens in my life and then again the women in my life and I made me cry. They cried a little too. They cried because I'm oh man kinda. I cried because our women, they attract jackasses. That jackass has been coming to my house for a long time. They're coming back here again. I still got one left of the house. She's a Caboose. She's 17. And they're coming back through. About three months ago, one come through that you wouldn't believe I couldn't believe myself. He's the worst I've ever seen. And I've seen a lot of bad ones. Maybe I'm getting older. He was in my house. He had his hat on. I said for crochet boys your head go. I want to tell you some when I was stealing, breaking into houses, I took my hat off for God's sake. Yeah. My daughter says, I'm embarrassed. I just maybe I'm going to tell you something. I'm going to tell you what I told your sisters. Because I'm a member. I'm a member of Alcoholics Anonymous. I've been sober 28 years. We've never had to say that's your drunken father on the kitchen floor. You never said that baby. And I have participated in your life. you've invited me to the Music Center. I go I see your dancer to jazz concerts and I see football games when I get splinters in my butt. And I have been a participant in the things that you want to do that you enjoy. which gives me the privilege to say I don't like that flaky bastard right there. We disagree without being totally disagreeable. The beauty of it is when I walked down the aisle I'm I've given them away and I'm married I'm gonna cry every foot of the way my son in laws I got a good deal they're all working and taking baths I got once a driller in the oil business I got another as a dentist I'm gonna have Jason gas anyway you want to cut it right? I got five granddaughters I got a grandson they come to my house and take the knobs off my TV they put peanut butter my slippers they make me cry all the time. Cuz I look at them I think about people that never saw grandkids do nothing. I'm overpaid. And but if you're sitting out there new tonight I'd like to tell you how overpaid I am but I couldn't find the proper words. How the hell you tell anybody every living thing you are? Is it because of Alcoholics Anonymous. I mean love thing I'll ever be in my life is going to be because of the program. I can only tell you friend It's been a long walk from Lincoln Heights. The LA county jail and appointed a standard day and but for the grace of God Alcoholics Anonymous and friends right you I could have missed it all. Thanks, man. God bless you.

John M 1:04:57

Norm Alfie is he credible or what? Don't you love that energy he has in his enthusiasm for the program of Alcoholics Anonymous, and how I carry the message for all those years. Hats off Mr. norm A I hope to meet you at the big meeting in the sky one day. That was absolutely fantastic. Now Oh by the way, if you have feedback on that, and you would like to write in, I'd love to hear from you john j. o h n as sober speak comm whether you want to write about norm or any of the other guests that we've had on, or you just want to say, Hello, I'm good with Oliver, we'd love to hear from you. Now on do a little bit of a listener feedback. But this first one, I don't know why if a designer, I guess seven my email all the time. And this guy wrote me I'm not gonna say his name. And you'll see why in a second. He says, Hi, john, my name is such and such. I recently wrote a three books set interviewing some of the biggest names in American craft beer. And then he wrote the title of his book, it was a new project. And I'm really excited to share this with you, as I know you are an authority on the subject. I wanted to give you a copy of the book, and etc, and asked if you could review it. Or if you'd like to share it with your audience. I would love the exposure and think that your audience would really enjoy it.

John M 1:06:43

And he goes on with some affiliate links and all this stuff he gives me and then he says, Thanks for your time, and I hope you enjoy this. And it's a value for both you and your audience. I thought I knew a lot about beer, but I've learned so much. Well, I'm thinking Mr. Well, I'm not gonna say the name. He says it cheers his name. I'm thinking that my audience may know actually a lot about craft beer. Yes, yes. I don't know. Don't you think these people would do just a tiny bit of research before they send you an email? I guess he got me off some list somewhere where but nonetheless. Good luck with your book, my friend, but I don't think I'll be sharing it with my audience. Sean writes that he says Good afternoon john. My name is Sean M. and N as in Nancy, from Gallup, New Mexico. My recovery has been a wonderful experience that I wouldn't trade it for anything. I found sober speak because you John M shared at my home group and one of our members. Oh, chastity. Jay Yes. Suggested sober speak. Yes, I do remember sharing at your home group and i think i don't think i think she chastity is in if I'm not mistaken, up in the Connecticut area somewhere. But nonetheless, it was on a zoom meeting. But I definitely remember Sherry, she and he says, I found your speakers to be amazing. And I always get something out of their shares. I've been on the spiritual path for all over for all over a year now and I will go to any lengths for my sobriety, Shawn and thank you, Shawn in for writing in. And I'm so glad that you have found this path along with me, and you will go to any length to stay sober is so good to hear from you. JOHN dmws me on the ground and this is not me demon myself. But anyway, he says, Hello, father bill. Excuse me, folks. We got a little allergies here in Texas today. But nonetheless, john says hello father bill is the man I've spent the last few weeks listening to his podcast. And I've learned so much I've been sharing his two way prayer or quiet time with my home group and other fellows. If you haven't listened to father build on the podcast, you can go back and find him. It's just like two, three episodes before this one. This this process of two way prayer has completely changed my process of meditation. I feel like I'm getting a more honest look at myself because of it is sending, seeing my past ego and pride more and more, more will be revealed. I fallen in love with this process of growth and mostly without exception without expectations. I am excited about the future. I could not be more grateful for you and your service. Would you On keep coming back. We love it. Thanks for listening. And I'm glad to be on this journey with you. My friend, Michelle, posted on the gram and this year regarding Anna Dee's episode and in today's episode is entitled Oh, let me pull this from my head. Oh, yeah, party girl 20 years later, or for you, Spanish listening for Spanish speaking individuals that be DS times too.

John M 1:10:36

Sure, there's a easier way to say 20. But hopefully, you're picking up what I'm laying down. You know, I'm saying, you know what I'm saying. Anyway, Michelle's she wrote in and she said, I really are posted. I really enjoyed this episode with Anna D. I immediately found her website and ordered one of her many books. JOHN, thank you so much for being so genuine and providing a platform for people to share their journeys Heart, heart, will Heart Heart back at you, Michelle, thank you very much. And I am more than happy to provide this service, as all of us kind of chip in and make this thing called the 12 step world or the Alcoholics Anonymous world or the allanon world or the sex addiction world or whatever it is. Go round. Jeremy writes in and this is our final entry for the week, Jeremy says hi John M is actually cool because I am typing you. And not just listening to the podcast. I live in a small coastal town of Powell river in British Columbia, Canada. I also have a second residence in Airdrie, Alberta, Canada and I work full time on in the Alberta oil sands. I drank quite heavy for most of my adult life as a child I knew I was a little quote off and usually behaved inappropriately, which caused a lot of fistfights. Yeah, I understand that fistfights and resulted in difficulty making friends and ajan in general, a really rough childhood because of it. The heart was huge, and I care deeply about everyone but my outside behavior, covered it all. When I was 17. When my 15 year old girlfriend pregnant, I discovered that alcohol even things out everything suddenly felt quote, okay, and I never looked back. Now fast forward 24 years I have two broken families, so much destructive behavior, crazy time, there's no way to type it all in one evening. Diabetes is cirrhosis of the liver. The doctor told me I was going to die. My reaction was finally thank goodness this is going to be over soon. The previous 10 years have been spent trying to drink myself to death and even and even the intense love I have for my two children wasn't enough to stop that process. I managed to quit drinking with the help of prescription meds, and a ton of willpower stayed sober for almost two years. Last January. Why work while working my tip my typical 21 days in camp work really

John M 1:13:34

slow I worked really slow. So spend 18 of the 21 days stuck in the jail cell C size camp room. It was that idle time when I discovered there was a difference between simply not drinking and recovery. I got so lost in my own head fighting the urge to drink that I decided to take my own life. enough was enough in this crap in these day and now because of course the world is better off without the loser. Obviously I'm still here but it was a wake up call realized by my journey. And I which hadn't even begun discovered. This was one of those silly a people who called White knuckling it so it was time for help. And I left work and applied for a leave of absence absence. While going through a month long adult addictions program on zoom COVID it was obvious more help was needed. And I was helpless against alcohol. That was a lot to MIT after all. I'm a tough guy a lone wolf and tough guys don't need help laugh out loud. I attended a meetings in Airdrie van my time off war came to an end and so off to work again. A is undoubtedly my hope but here's my current problem. Up here I work 2112 hour shifts with no access to meetings. By the time I get back to camp, I'm exhausted and I go right to sleep. So zoom meetings are nearly impossible. Also a never got the chance to find a sponsor. Life after work is stretched pretty thin between obligations in between the two provinces I live in. This is where your podcasts come in. You are my You are not my meeting between meetings. You and your guests are my meetings. I'm so thankful to be able to turn you on. I think I know what he meant during lunch break. And the long lonely drives while traveling all over Western Canada. Oh, so thank you so much here we thank you for all your do. Sending much love from the great white north, your new friend Jeremy as well thank you, my friend from the great white north. Jeremy as I'm so glad that we can be part of your journey with you. And man. people stay sober in all kinds of circumstances. I'm glad you're hanging in there. I know you will find your way if you pray and keep trying. That folks wraps up another episode of the pod. As I always say I'm taking this one week at a time we will hopefully be back next week Until then, keep coming back at works if you work at love you guys be well.


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